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Post by sw1 on Oct 15, 2013 13:57:13 GMT
Any improvements on the rules stick up here.
My 2p:
- Captain stat line needs to read 3 wounds
- Random event 56 needs to exist
- Too many saves were being taken. 4+ for the Captain and 5+ for the crew plus a 5+ while the doc's about is fine. However the Doc is going to be the last crew to die so maybe a mute point.
- To stop crews getting bloated maybe do a GorkaMorka rule if a model falls off while moving they have to make role to get back on board or drown.
There's quite a few more things but I'm struggling to remember them.
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Post by Farseer Kyladras on Oct 15, 2013 14:13:48 GMT
Game was epic and I can't wait to play it again (with a badmoonz ship of my own next time  ) My thoughts on the game (I know it was the first time it was ever played so there were bound to be `bugs` in it but here goes: -Ships that are sunk, leave off rather than respawning at the dock, players who are `knocked out` of the game will always find something else to occupy themselves with other games/ opponents or just watching the main ship game) this will speed the game up as ships are sunk, less players left to fight) -Instead of having the boarding actions as captain to captain and crew to crew, have them all as a mixed melee with the captain's obviously better stats etc boosting the fight rather than having 2 separate fights (unless a challenge is issued maybe, like current 40k close combat fighting) - reduce the minimum forward move, yeah I understand that with big ships comes big movement but moving from standstill the minimum distance a ship could move was 20" plus the length of the ship (that's right isn't it?) even with large ships that is a huge distance meaning that tactical movement was very difficult in such crowded seas leading to lots of collisions (yes I know Orks and strategy shouldn't go together but still...) Overall though, the game was masses of fun to play and I hope we get to play it again one day Oh and, not an addition to the ship game rules, I would still just love to play a version of it where everyone has a boat and a plane for kamikaze, strafe running fun  FK |
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Post by Lord Draconiroth on Oct 15, 2013 14:55:45 GMT
One you've not mentioned was to have BS3 gunners rather than BS2.
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Post by badfang on Oct 15, 2013 16:22:35 GMT
One you've not mentioned was to have BS3 gunners rather than BS2. Agreed, orky shooting depends on loads of gunz going off in the general direction of da uvva gitz, when theres only one or two gunz can fire per turn there won't be many hits, and when any shots that do hit have to roll for penetration and bounce off the back of a blimp(!) there's not a lot of damage going on. On the subject of shooting, most of my casualties in the boarding actions were as a result of Bloo Funda firing broadsides of grapeshot at my kroo who were in hand to hand combat with Bloo Funda's kroo at the time - I think that is kind of covered by this though 'prior' being the operative word. Do agree with Steve's comment about too many saves - 5+, 6+, 5+ was probably at least one too many, which stoopid git suggested da ships surjon for an fnp save -  . I'd also got the impression that as Blood Axes were using sub-akwa assault teams rather than torpedos, they wouldn't have the same 'straight ahead' targeting restrictions as they were swimming rather than being shot out of tubes? Paul's 'crowded seas' could have been sorted at least partially by taking all the non-gaming ships off the board completely rather than just parking them up in port - effectively turning it into a relatively huge island in the centre of the board. But, for all that, it was still 'Yohoho and a barrel of laffs' Nice one Kaptin Bob  |
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Post by ZOG! on Oct 15, 2013 18:21:23 GMT
But, for all that, it was still 'Yohoho and a barrel of laffs' Nice one Kaptin Bob Oh yes it was fun, and I think this shows it that the rules we are discussing we want to amend so we can play it again |
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Post by sw1 on Oct 15, 2013 18:35:33 GMT
But, for all that, it was still 'Yohoho and a barrel of laffs' Nice one Kaptin Bob Oh yes it was fun, and I think this shows it that the rules we are discussing we want to amend so we can play it again Yes it needs a little tweaking but it's a keeper!!! Might even try it at a smaller scale using man-o-war size ships. |
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Post by Harkon Greywolf on Oct 15, 2013 22:18:28 GMT
OK all good stuff chaps. I'll re-run the rules with added changes as abive where I think they'll improve the flow of the game. Obviously I thought about the rules a heck of a lot whilst writing them but Play-testing was the only way to try them out for real! Glad the overall impression was that of a success and wanting to play it again! HG |
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Post by badfang on Oct 21, 2013 11:35:39 GMT
Not sure about having grots shooting the guns - how about orks shooting as normal needing 5+ to hit at full strength but dropping -1S on the strength for every one that they fail the hit roll on (so a 'to hit' roll of two would be an S6 hit from the main gun, ones always miss) - ships are big targets and even if they miss the bit they're aiming at, the shot won't necessarily miss completely?
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Post by Harkon Greywolf on Oct 21, 2013 12:09:29 GMT
OK, just summarising the Rules points for tweaking here, if anyone has any more please feel free to add a post below, I will take all these under advisement and come back with my changes and reasons shortly. - Captain stat line needs to read 3 wounds - Random event 56 needs to exist - Too many saves were being taken. 4+ for the Captain and 5+ for the crew plus a 5+ while the doc's about is fine. However the Doc is going to be the last crew to die so maybe a moot point. - To stop crews getting bloated maybe do a GorkaMorka rule if a model falls off while moving they have to make role to get back on board or drown. -Ships that are sunk, leave off rather than respawning at the dock, players who are `knocked out` of the game will always find something else to occupy themselves with other games/ opponents or just watching the main ship game) this will speed the game up as ships are sunk, less players left to fight) -Instead of having the boarding actions as captain to captain and crew to crew, have them all as a mixed melee with the captain's obviously better stats etc boosting the fight rather than having 2 separate fights (unless a challenge is issued maybe, like current 40k close combat fighting) - reduce the minimum forward move, yeah I understand that with big ships comes big movement but moving from standstill the minimum distance a ship could move was 20" plus the length of the ship (that's right isn't it?) even with large ships that is a huge distance meaning that tactical movement was very difficult in such crowded seas leading to lots of collisions (yes I know Orks and strategy shouldn't go together but still...) - One you've not mentioned was to have BS3 gunners rather than BS2. - On the subject of shooting, most of my casualties in the boarding actions were as a result of Bloo Funda firing broadsides of grapeshot at my kroo who were in hand to hand combat with Bloo Funda's kroo at the time - I think that is kind of covered by this though Q: The Grapeshot cannot hurt any boat as S4 vs AV11 min. .. so not sure what is meant by the 6+ inv being ignored by it. Will grapeshot be specifically targeted at the crew? A: Yep! Grapeshot is entirely Krew target-related. It's the case of "Sweeping the decks" prior to boarding or being boarded! The side guns are to give the option, try and sink the enemy boat or try and whittle down the Krew, the Aft gun is purely there to deter anyone from trying to board from behind! (They don't like it up 'em!) - 'prior' being the operative word.- Do agree with Steve's comment about too many saves - 5+, 6+, 5+ was probably at least one too many, which stoopid git suggested da ships surjon for an fnp save - . - I'd also got the impression that as Blood Axes were using sub-akwa assault teams rather than torpedos, they wouldn't have the same 'straight ahead' targeting restrictions as they were swimming rather than being shot out of tubes? - Paul's 'crowded seas' could have been sorted at least partially by taking all the non-gaming ships off the board completely rather than just parking them up in port - effectively turning it into a relatively huge island in the centre of the board. - Not sure about having grots shooting the guns - how about orks shooting as normal needing 5+ to hit at full strength but dropping -1S on the strength for every one that they fail the hit roll on (so a 'to hit' roll of two would be an S6 hit from the main gun, ones always miss) - ships are big targets and even if they miss the bit they're aiming at, the shot won't necessarily miss completely? HG |
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Post by Harkon Greywolf on Oct 21, 2013 12:11:02 GMT
OK one I've just remembered talking about. Should we increase the Kaptin's Leadership from 8 to 9 so that it's not so easy to beat the Krews whilst the Kaptin is alive? Or was it more fun with Krews being taken over left, right and centre?  HG |
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Post by Harkon Greywolf on Oct 21, 2013 14:00:12 GMT
Ok, addressing the points listed: - Captain stat line needs to read 3 wounds - Amended now W3, still need responses to Ld 8 or 9, see end point!- Random event 56 needs to exist - Amended, inserted another Kraken appearance! In my opinion it didn't turn up soon enough in the game! - Too many saves were being taken. 4+ for the Captain and 5+ for the crew plus a 5+ while the doc's about is fine. However the Doc is going to be the last crew to die so maybe a moot point. - Amended to exclude Bionics 6+, now only Armour and FNP!- To stop crews getting bloated maybe do a GorkaMorka rule if a model falls off while moving they have to make role to get back on board or drown. - Suggest we limit maximum Krews to 10? So you may take on 4 additional Krew when docked? But yes, they must be able to "stand" on the ship! -Ships that are sunk, leave off rather than respawning at the dock, players who are `knocked out` of the game will always find something else to occupy themselves with other games/ opponents or just watching the main ship game) this will speed the game up as ships are sunk, less players left to fight) - This was weekend specific as I wanted as many people in the game all the time so we could test it properly. Normally it would be a "knock-out" competition! -Instead of having the boarding actions as captain to captain and crew to crew, have them all as a mixed melee with the captain's obviously better stats etc boosting the fight rather than having 2 separate fights (unless a challenge is issued maybe, like current 40k close combat fighting) - I still see Kaptin v Kaptin as an automatic Challenge event. Otherwise the Krew will be far more easily wiped out, and, with the exception of Alan and Steve's epic "non"-combat, most fights only took 1 or 2 rounds of combat anyway! I don't propose changing this rule at present, unless there are a suitable number of objections?- reduce the minimum forward move, yeah I understand that with big ships comes big movement but moving from standstill the minimum distance a ship could move was 20" plus the length of the ship (that's right isn't it?) even with large ships that is a huge distance meaning that tactical movement was very difficult in such crowded seas leading to lots of collisions (yes I know Orks and strategy shouldn't go together but still...) - I have reduced the Minimum moves by a few inches. Card 1 by 3" for example. I agree that the dock was too crowded by the non-player boats and that this would have made it easier to manoeuvre, but have also taken on board the requirement for a lesser move. Especially as I have now enshrined in the rules that the move is to include the boat length! - One you've not mentioned was to have BS3 gunners rather than BS2. - Done, I think the main guns did very little damage and so this rule change will stand!- On the subject of shooting, most of my casualties in the boarding actions were as a result of Bloo Funda firing broadsides of grapeshot at my kroo who were in hand to hand combat with Bloo Funda's kroo at the time - I think that is kind of covered by this though Q: The Grapeshot cannot hurt any boat as S4 vs AV11 min. .. so not sure what is meant by the 6+ inv being ignored by it. Will grapeshot be specifically targeted at the crew? A: Yep! Grapeshot is entirely Krew target-related. It's the case of "Sweeping the decks" prior to boarding or being boarded! The side guns are to give the option, try and sink the enemy boat or try and whittle down the Krew, the Aft gun is purely there to deter anyone from trying to board from behind! (They don't like it up 'em!) - 'prior' being the operative word. - This was something I had not really appreciated and didn't see the problem "in game" but looking at it afterwards I agree, and I have changed to rule to read that Grapeshot can only be used in the shooting phase prior to a successful Boarding action. Once engaged ships cannot fire Grapeshot at the Krews in combat!- Do agree with Steve's comment about too many saves - 5+, 6+, 5+ was probably at least one too many, which stoopid git suggested da ships surjon for an fnp save - . - Dealt with, Bionics removed! - I'd also got the impression that as Blood Axes were using sub-akwa assault teams rather than torpedoes, they wouldn't have the same 'straight ahead' targeting restrictions as they were swimming rather than being shot out of tubes? - Again this was a "test rule" and I've now changed the Torpedoe rules slightly. Blood Axes are now able to "fire" in the 90 degree front arc rather than straight ahead from the ship. But I've reduced their range to 18" as this seems to be more appropriate as no-scatter will still provide a big advantage over normal Torpedoes! I now see the Blood Axe Torpedoes as "manned/guided" torps rather than a frogman unit!- Paul's 'crowded seas' could have been sorted at least partially by taking all the non-gaming ships off the board completely rather than just parking them up in port - effectively turning it into a relatively huge island in the centre of the board. - Agreed, I think I was influenced by wanting to see all the ships on the table! Beginners enthusiasm! The mistake will not happen again! LOL- Not sure about having grots shooting the guns - how about orks shooting as normal needing 5+ to hit at full strength but dropping -1S on the strength for every one that they fail the hit roll on (so a 'to hit' roll of two would be an S6 hit from the main gun, ones always miss) - ships are big targets and even if they miss the bit they're aiming at, the shot won't necessarily miss completely? - I see the point, but I think this will overlky complicate the game even more than it already is. For simplicity let's just keep with the Grots firing the main guns, as they do with 40k artillery etc, and leave the Orks to do the hand to hand fighting! - Should we increase the Kaptin's Leadership from 8 to 9 so that it's not so easy to beat the Krews whilst the Kaptin is alive? Or was it more fun with Krews being taken over left, right and centre? - OK, need opinions on this one please. I'm tempted to say leave it at 8 and let the "take-overs" predominate but can be swayed by "public opinion" as always!
OK, now over to you lot again! HG (Amended rules will be posted in the main Rules thread shortly!) |
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Post by Farseer Kyladras on Oct 21, 2013 18:23:16 GMT
Nice one Bob! Looks like all the problems have been addressed now when do we get to play again? I'm starting my ship (and mini ship) build at the weekend, can't wait to play this again!! Oh and Da Kaptin should be LD9, it's only right and proppa! FK |
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Post by Harkon Greywolf on Oct 21, 2013 18:53:12 GMT
Thanks mate!
Anyone else re the Leadership?
HG
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The Irontooth
Bloodclaw
Tale of Gamers: 3 units, 4 pieces of terrain
Posts: 387
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Post by The Irontooth on Oct 21, 2013 18:58:30 GMT
Thanks mate! Anyone else re the Leadership? HG Can't you give certain Klans' Captains an extra Ld while other's an extra A, ... ? |
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Post by badfang on Oct 21, 2013 19:12:39 GMT
Thanks mate! Anyone else re the Leadership? HG Can't you give certain Klans' Captains an extra Ld while other's an extra A, ... ? Doubt that'd work too well, Goffs would need the extra A but coz they're too fikk to realise they're losing they'd need the extra Ld as well, BadMoons'd pay some zogger else to fight for them, DeffSkulz'd nick the attackers choppa, EvilSunz would have attacked yesterday, Gork knows what SnakeBites would be up to and the BloodAxes are behind you |
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